Isaiah Still is transferring
- Thread starter R-M-U-h-o-o-p-s-f-a-n
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Crap, it just is not as much fun anymore being a college basketball fan. 
Crap, it just is not as much fun anymore being a college basketball fan.
All about you as the person & nothing about your school pride & stuff.
I believe that takes us down to five returning players, including David Cole, who did not play any minutes this past season. And, who knows, there could be more transfers to come. This is not COLLEGE basketball, this is minor league rent a player for a year or two. I am starting to think there is no point in recruiting freshmen out of high school. Just recruit JUCOs, or maybe get top D-II players to transfer in. Or, recruit western Pennsylvania players that may not be as highly rated but are more likely to stay and be good players by their Jr and Sr years. Maybe the RMU administration needs to take a hard look at all the factors to determine if building a "program" is even possible anymore before following through with a $50 million events center. Maybe the RMU men's coaches need to take some lessons from the women's coaches on how to build a program. As things are now there is a lot less incentive for fans to attend RMU games, or other NEC level games, than there used to be. Maybe RMU should drop to DIII and recruit students/athletes whose main goal is to get a degree. I don't know, I am just a frustrated fan right now.
This is rough. I think Still is a great NEC player, not sure how much higher of conference he will be able to go to and get make a big impact. Maybe that's not accurate, but just my view.
Without being in a higher profile conference, this will continue. As Toole said, not sure if an article or radio, but to paraphrase, he is almost worried when the young guys play great. Almost seeing the future transfer happening.
NEC men's bball is currently is a glorified JUCO league. Bottom line. Not really what Toole can do, he gets good players, they perform, then move on. I just think how darn good they could be right now. I think we loose Toole because of this, if the school does not move to better conference, he will leave.
Without being in a higher profile conference, this will continue. As Toole said, not sure if an article or radio, but to paraphrase, he is almost worried when the young guys play great. Almost seeing the future transfer happening.
NEC men's bball is currently is a glorified JUCO league. Bottom line. Not really what Toole can do, he gets good players, they perform, then move on. I just think how darn good they could be right now. I think we loose Toole because of this, if the school does not move to better conference, he will leave.
Which is why we could see Toole leave. Nothing is going to change with transfers even with a new arena. RMU's only hope, leave the NEC and move to a higher conference.
100% agree with you. I would wager that Toole is making this clear to admin. Probably would never happen, and know there would be an initial struggle, but any chance at all they could jump all the way to the A-10? Would be a good travel partner for Duq. Probably a bigger jump than possible, but doesn't hurt to aim high.
100% agree ORMC. I would imagine Toole is making this clear to the admin. They need to move up ASAP. Probably not realistic, but would love to see them jump right up to A-10. Would be a great travel partner for Duq. Again, probably a bit high, but I say aim high and see what the hell happens.
Not to derail this and make it about football, but would likely leave them without a conference, I think Monmouth wanted to stay NEC football for a little while and were told they were not welcome.
Not to derail this and make it about football, but would likely leave them without a conference, I think Monmouth wanted to stay NEC football for a little while and were told they were not welcome.
This hurts to say this but football has to take a back burner to hoops and hockey. If RMU wants to keep Toole and win again for men's hoops, they have to sell the school to larger conferences now. They are going to have to open the pocket book big time. But they talk about being the Gonzaga of the East....well that won't happen in the NEC.
Again, agreed with you 100%. A10 might be a pipe dream, but they should do every single thing in their power to go for it. That would raise the school's profile incredibly, and maybe the new arena, and recent academic rankings might be enough to get them into it. Do not know if Duq would fight against it or not, would think they probably would, but the other schools might like it as far as travel goes.
As to the A-10, it might be a better move than even the Horizon League (which is pretty dang good). While some might think RMU would be more competitive in the Horizon, it's still a 1 bid league. The A10 gets at least 2, Normally 3-6 bids to the NCAAT per year.
While both of those are probably too big of a jump at once, the MAAC, Patriot League, or CAA might be a good move for RMU.
I think we need to get back on track (over .500 record & playing postseason hoops) & leave the NEC within 5-6 years max.
Needs to happen soon.
Ya...
Still doubtful that RMU would make that big of a move tho.
From a bottom 5 conference to a top 7-8 conference in the A-10 would be huge move.
Ty, I think duq was allowed because they were joining as just a football associate member. Monmouth was a full member and wanted to leave for all sports, but stay in nec for football only. The league said no.
Now, maybe that stay certain has changed, and perhaps with rmu being an outlier geographically, the conference would be ok with them as football only.
Now, maybe that stay certain has changed, and perhaps with rmu being an outlier geographically, the conference would be ok with them as football only.
Original_RMC you seem to think Toole has options to leave. Where would he go? The only actual offer that he may have ever gotten was Fordham, and I do not know if it actually reached the point of being an actual offer. That was two years ago when he was the hot young coach, and Fordham was considered to be a terrible job. Now he has had two consecutive losing seasons, and with a depleted roster once again, he will likely have another losing season. His only option for moving up in the foreseeable future would be as an assistant coach at a high level program. With the new arena, RMU may be in a position to move up a step in conference, but not a very big step. I am not sure that would solve the transfer issues, it will just be a conference that will be more difficult to win a championship to claim the one NCAA bid. RMU's roster has been getting decimated every year for the past four years or so. We can talk about the handful of kids that "moved up" but RMU also loses too many other players for other reasons. I still support and like Andy very much, and I hope he is the RMU coach for a long time, but up until two years ago we all thought he had the magic to out coach anyone and to win under any circumstances, we also thought that RMU had things figured out and could dominate the NEC consistently. The truth of the matter is, for whatever reasons, RMU basketball has never caught on to build much of a fan base. I have been asked by various friends and family, why is Robert Morris building a new arena, it looks as though they rarely fill the one they have. It has to be discouraging to players to play in front of so many empty seats, bleachers. RMU had a great run from when Mike Rice became head coach until two years ago, yet RMU still has a limited fan base, a NEC level fan base.
I hope the other folks that participate on this board will give reason to be optimistic. Let's hear it.
I hope the other folks that participate on this board will give reason to be optimistic. Let's hear it.
Ya we did think RMU could just run the NEC.
The thing is that we actually should be up top in this league every year.
Toole does lose several players each year to transferring but he still had success putting together winning teams before. He is still held with that now.
Even the 2015-16 team still shocks me that with Elijah Minnie, Rodney Pryor, & Kavon Stewart they only won 10 games all year. Not to mention Isaiah Still as a freshman.
As to attendance, some people on the Pitt hoops board said they had no interest coming to watch NEC level competition @ RMU. But several said that they'd come out to watch RMU play in the MAAC & play Monmouth or Iona.
If RMU gets its act back together & does well in the MAAC, an increase in fans may come out.
As to the new arena, a positive of it would be that more people would come out to see them play in a good facility. The UPMC Events Center should be pretty nice & will seat over 4,000 people (a move that makes u think leaving the NEC soon is/has to happen).
So after all this, maybe we can start out getting an avg of 2,000 + a game at the new arena? That would be a good start.
I think getting Pitt to come in and play in the new facility would be a great PR move as well to let more people know about it & to get a sell out in it as well.
More thoughts??
Go RMU...
I know Toole doesn't have other programs knocking on his door. Those days are over. He had that chance after that Kentucky win. But since then, he committed to RMU and we are damn lucky to have him.
Let's be honest....RMU is stepping stone for any great young coach or administrator and now, even basketball players.
I honestly don't know where Toole would go. I know Dayton is now open but due to their recent success over the years, they will want a name from a top tier program.
I know from some of my talks that the other NEC school do talk about the required travel for two programs, St. Francis and RMU. You remove them and the NEC because a true Northeast conference in terms of locations.
I'm not sure what the answer is for RMU. Recruit more local talent and build your program from the ground up. Increase attendance that way and get kids that want to play for RMU. It's the same battle football has. You recruit these young men from all over the country, some stay, many leave. Perhaps you circle the wagon against top PIAA basketball especially WPIAL
You currently have two players on the roster from PA, Matty and Seth (walk-on).
If you want to fill that area you must improve on two areas:
1. Win
2. Recruit more local talent
Let's be honest....RMU is stepping stone for any great young coach or administrator and now, even basketball players.
I honestly don't know where Toole would go. I know Dayton is now open but due to their recent success over the years, they will want a name from a top tier program.
I know from some of my talks that the other NEC school do talk about the required travel for two programs, St. Francis and RMU. You remove them and the NEC because a true Northeast conference in terms of locations.
I'm not sure what the answer is for RMU. Recruit more local talent and build your program from the ground up. Increase attendance that way and get kids that want to play for RMU. It's the same battle football has. You recruit these young men from all over the country, some stay, many leave. Perhaps you circle the wagon against top PIAA basketball especially WPIAL
You currently have two players on the roster from PA, Matty and Seth (walk-on).
If you want to fill that area you must improve on two areas:
1. Win
2. Recruit more local talent
Lots of good talk here. A few thoughts.
One, just so everyone is on the same page, this is an epidemic across all of college basketball, and has hit the NEC particularly hard. It is not just an RMU issue. Broome, Vinanles, Mobley, Nebo, BK Ashe just to name a few from the past few seasons.
I do think a move in conference would be a good idea. While football is the wild card, the Big South would be an option (albeit travel would be tough). They currently have only six teams and lost Coastal Carolina recently to the Sun Belt. I also think the NEC may elect to keep RMU, as losing them would take them down to only six members, and RMU is an easy travel for multiple league members.
So where to? The logical answer is the MAAC. One, they only have 11 teams right now, and will without doubt add a 12th team soon. Two the league is a MAJOR upgrade in RPI, where it is almost every year, ranked anywhere from 13-16, while the NEC is close to last. Going to the A10 just wont happen, it's too big of a jump and Duquesne is already in the league. Horizon wont happen, they just added Northern Kentucky and outside of geography there isn't much of a fit. RMU would fit well in the MAAC and travel would remain about the same (NYC, NE area). The league is mostly a one bid league, yes, but it is a very competitive one bid league that occasionally gets multiple bids, and does not have an issue with up-transfers.
I still think the best idea though, for now, is to stay in the NEC, and fix other issues. The facility is a major part. Yes attendance needs to improve, but that facility opens up so many more doors. Kids want to have top tier locker rooms, weight rooms, facilities, etc. It could also open the door to some more appetizing non-conference games. Next, amenities like food, living areas, travel, etc. This is why RMU cut a few programs, so they could focus more $$$ for things like this. It needs to continue and improve. Lastly, winning.
Yes RMU got hot and made the NCAA tournament a few years back, but let's not forget that team stunk most of the year and was a Tate tip-in vs CCSU from hitting rock bottom. Even still, almost that whole team stayed. I had multiple people tell me that Marcquise Reed was leaving no matter what in January of that season. Nothing you can do about that. But Pryor, Minnie, Kavon etc all came back. It wasn't until the next season that Minnie had a falling out and left, and that started a mini ripple effect. If Andy can get a core that can win, make an NCAA tournament, etc with this facility on the way, you have a great shot at keeping most of the team in my opinion.
One, just so everyone is on the same page, this is an epidemic across all of college basketball, and has hit the NEC particularly hard. It is not just an RMU issue. Broome, Vinanles, Mobley, Nebo, BK Ashe just to name a few from the past few seasons.
I do think a move in conference would be a good idea. While football is the wild card, the Big South would be an option (albeit travel would be tough). They currently have only six teams and lost Coastal Carolina recently to the Sun Belt. I also think the NEC may elect to keep RMU, as losing them would take them down to only six members, and RMU is an easy travel for multiple league members.
So where to? The logical answer is the MAAC. One, they only have 11 teams right now, and will without doubt add a 12th team soon. Two the league is a MAJOR upgrade in RPI, where it is almost every year, ranked anywhere from 13-16, while the NEC is close to last. Going to the A10 just wont happen, it's too big of a jump and Duquesne is already in the league. Horizon wont happen, they just added Northern Kentucky and outside of geography there isn't much of a fit. RMU would fit well in the MAAC and travel would remain about the same (NYC, NE area). The league is mostly a one bid league, yes, but it is a very competitive one bid league that occasionally gets multiple bids, and does not have an issue with up-transfers.
I still think the best idea though, for now, is to stay in the NEC, and fix other issues. The facility is a major part. Yes attendance needs to improve, but that facility opens up so many more doors. Kids want to have top tier locker rooms, weight rooms, facilities, etc. It could also open the door to some more appetizing non-conference games. Next, amenities like food, living areas, travel, etc. This is why RMU cut a few programs, so they could focus more $$$ for things like this. It needs to continue and improve. Lastly, winning.
Yes RMU got hot and made the NCAA tournament a few years back, but let's not forget that team stunk most of the year and was a Tate tip-in vs CCSU from hitting rock bottom. Even still, almost that whole team stayed. I had multiple people tell me that Marcquise Reed was leaving no matter what in January of that season. Nothing you can do about that. But Pryor, Minnie, Kavon etc all came back. It wasn't until the next season that Minnie had a falling out and left, and that started a mini ripple effect. If Andy can get a core that can win, make an NCAA tournament, etc with this facility on the way, you have a great shot at keeping most of the team in my opinion.
Good points.
-How many more years till moving up to the MAAC?
-Obviously you said we need to get back to winning ways till we move up but we also have to keep the fact that the MAAC may fill that 12th spot shortly.
-So, get back to the NIT/NCAA Tournament within the next 2 years & call up the MAAC to do the move would be my ideal situation.
-Need to get back to winning (over .500 & playoffs) and the move would/will only continue more good vibes.
Go RMU...
MAAC has said they are in no rush, but having 11 teams makes scheduling very difficult for regular season and post season. It's tough to put a number on this, but conference realignment usually goes in waves. I could see movement in two/three years. Even if the MAAC does not take RMU, the Colonials would likely have an opportunity to move into another conference that the MAAC took from. I 100 percent think RMU will not rush this though.
Ya I agree not to move this year but in 2/3 years (w/ some success) would be a good idea.
